The following interview appeared originally in German in Die Weltwoche on June 18, 2021. Translated into English by Xuxu Song. A separate commentary by David Pan appears here.
Hans-Georg Maaßen, President of Germany’s Federal Office for the Protection of the Constitution from 2012 to 2018, is accused of spreading anti-Semitic ideas. The accusation comes from the milieu of the “Fridays for Future” movement. The timing, Maaßen suspects, is no coincidence and has nothing to do with the political climate. Rather, they want to prevent his election as a member of the Bundestag.
Weltwoche: Mr. Maaßen, how long were you head of the Federal Office for the Protection of the Constitution?
Maaßen: Six years, three months, and fifteen days. It was a 24-hours-a-day, six-days-a-week job. When I was appointed by Interior Minister Hans-Peter Friedrich, I said to him, “You can do this for four to seven years, then you have to stop, and then you need another assignment.”
Weltwoche: And it worked!
Maaßen: Yes. I imagined it a little differently, but if you are a political official you know that you can be sent into temporary retirement at any time. It happens again and again, but rarely under such circumstances as in my case, with a loud drum roll.
Weltwoche: There was a certain drama in it.
Maaßen: You could also say that. It also had some entertainment value for the journalists.
Weltwoche: So, you were head of the Federal Office for the Protection of the Constitution for over six years. Can you explain to me how you have managed to cover up the fact that you are an anti-Semite all these years?
Maaßen: Because I am not an anti-Semite. Their argument was a tactical one. I also get the impression that some people who “concerned themselves with” me were not concerned with the truth.
Weltwoche: You were also upgraded to the status of an anti-Semite quite late.
Maaßen: Only after I left the office. Before that, nobody had thought of seeing me as an anti-Semite because I am precisely not one. Quite the contrary, in the past I always enjoyed going to Israel, and I met many people there with whom I became friends. I envied the Israelis because they have such a clear idea of life that is shaped by the situation around them.
Weltwoche: That you enjoyed going to Israel and that you liked it there doesn’t necessarily mean that you can’t be an anti-Semite.
Maaßen: Right. But as a lawyer, I would say it’s a rebuttable presumption. I am simply not.
Weltwoche: Rather than focusing on the rebuttable presumption, I would be more interested in the motivation of the people who accuse you of being an anti-Semite. In my experience it would be necessary to prove such an allegation. Where is the evidence in your case?
Maaßen: There is none. Anti-Semitism is also not the central issue in the dispute over me. There are some people who don’t want me in the Bundestag.
Weltwoche: Can you please specify that?
Maaßen: We have 299 constituencies, and I’m only one candidate in one of those constituencies. But people are dealing with me very intensively in the media and in politics, in a way as if the result of the elections would depend on whether I will make it into the Bundestag or not. I am demonized. Der Spiegel writes that I am the “Mephisto.” Around the world, I believe I have been compared with the devil.
Weltwoche: Mr. Maaßen, I would give a lot to have someone write about me like that!
Maaßen: You are in a different role and position. In politics that does not count as any kind of recommendation. But it shows me that people who argue like that are obviously scared of me. If they thought I was harmless, they would say, “This is just one of the 299 representatives, his power as a representative is very limited.” I don’t tend to overestimate myself, but my opponents or my enemies do. That’s why they want to prove that I am a very bad person, that I celebrate Satanic masses with the Alternative for Germany, that I don’t separate the trash, and other such things people say when they want to bring someone into disrepute. They have read my dissertation, gone through all sorts of things I have said and written, and now they are trying to insinuate that I am an anti-Semite because I have used terms that others apparently use as anti-Semitic code words, which completely escaped me.
Weltwoche: For clarification: it is mainly about the term “globalist,” an anti-Semitic cipher for “Jew.” I have to admit that I have never stumbled upon this term, at least not in the last 35 years since my book The Eternal Anti-Semite was published, neither by right-wing nor by left-wing Jew-haters. “Cosmopolitans,” “exploiters,” “speculators,” “locusts” as synonyms for Jews: there are terms like these. Globalists: no. The CEO of Volkswagen would then also be a globalist—VW is a global company.
Maaßen: I don’t think Ms. Luisa Neubauer had such subtleties in mind when she accused me on Anne Will of using terms with anti-Semitic connotations like “globalist.” She had no evidence other than claiming that I would use code words.
Weltwoche: Were you offended by that?
Maaßen: Of course I was offended by that. Although hardly anything offends me now—I only allow a few things to affect me, in order not to go crazy. But: there is indeed hardly a worse accusation than being an anti-Semite . . .
Weltwoche: . . . except for those who actually are.
Maaßen: Yes, but misuse of this term for political purposes is a pestilence. “Fascist” or “Nazi” too, by the way. If you see how often and how arbitrarily these terms are being used, you might think that there have never been so many “fascists” and “Nazis” in Germany as there are today. It is either malice or historical ignorance, or both. In any case it is a means to get political opponents out of the way.
Weltwoche: I am surprised that people who sympathize with a thoroughly anti-Semitic movement like BDS, which calls for a boycott of Israel, accuse you of being an anti-Semite.
Maaßen: I am surprised too. I guess that’s also why I’m an anti-Semite because I show solidarity with Israel.
Weltwoche: From Antifa’s point of view: definitely.
Maaßen: A lot has gotten jumbled up in Germany. Mentally, humanly, and politically. Every day we hear: “1933 must not repeat itself!,” “Auschwitz never again!,” and the same people who throw such slogans around have no qualms about claiming that Israel is threatening world peace and that by no means should we provide Israel with military support—that would only fuel the conflict with the Palestinians.
Weltwoche: Have you thought of taking legal action against Ms. Neubauer, perhaps with the help of an injunction?
Maaßen: I’m a lawyer after all, so I have indeed considered that. It is a matter of weighing up costs against benefits. By costs I don’t mean court fees. Both on the high seas and in court you are in God’s hands. As a lawyer, I also know that in court you get a verdict but not always justice. In addition, the term “anti-Semite” has changed over time in jurisprudence. In the past, you had to provide evidence to support such an allegation, and that was objectifiable . . .
Weltwoche: . . . the denial of the Holocaust, for instance.
Maaßen: . . . today it is about subjective feelings. Ms. Neubauer doesn’t have to prove that I am an anti-Semite—I must prove that I am not. Lawyers call this reverse onus.
Weltwoche: It’s actually an absurdity in a constitutional state.
Maaßen: We are dealing with a creeping process that began many years ago, not with an explosion but rather with many small eruptions: with the “long march through the institutions,” anti-authoritarian daycare centers, and so on. Some things were accepted with a shrug because they didn’t directly affect you; with other things, you were surprised, but let them happen.
Weltwoche: Some of what you are saying sounds like a conspiracy theory.
Maaßen: If in the constituency in which I am now running, the left parties, i.e., the SPD, the Greens, and the Left, are debating whether they should agree on a common candidate in order to prevent me from being elected, then this is not a conspiracy theory but realpolitik. I just have to acknowledge that, from their perspective, I am perceived as a political enemy who must be worn down and destroyed. Many people break down mentally or even physically when they are marginalized. When they are not taken along to the cafeteria for lunch or when colleagues sit down at another table. Others say to themselves: What good is it that I have my own opinion if my own relatives no longer invite me to weddings and funerals? Isn’t the price too high? Such is human nature.
Weltwoche: Do you see yourself as a victim? If three parties join forces against you, then you drive them in front of you, then you are the driver and they are your prey.
Maaßen: I see myself as a fighter for the liberal democratic basic order itself, for a liberal constitutional state. And what is happening in this country worries me—that we are slipping into an authoritarian state, into a state-sponsored cowardice. I want people to notice where we are going and to become citizens, not subjects who are wards of the state that provides them with everything they need to live. Many people have lost the ability to lead a self-determined life, to take risks. More and more people are becoming dependent on transfer payments.
